Over-Confidence / Arrogance / Euphoria

[imrevankessel]

Hey Melo,

What works for me is trying to keep myself busy busy busy and not to ruminate too much. I've added swimming to my afternoon schedule, it replaced my 5 PM drink. For me swimming is like meditation. Just trying to keep track of the number of laps I've done requires concentration purely on the swimming. And of course it's great exercise.

I also plan to start Thai boxing lessons. I did it before, and even though I am very very old fart by the standards of that sport, it's a great way to train myself mentally and physically, as this sport also requires lots of concentration. It do it just for the fun of it, and I get to look at lots of fit and great looking guys!

Of course to each his own hobbies and sports, but I think the most important thing is to try to stay busy so you have no time to think about alcohol?

[Jarvis]

Hi Melo, and a big "well done" for battling on!

I agree with Belle and Imrevankessel - keeping occupied is a really important thing to do. The things that trigger us to want a drink become a lot stronger when we don't have anything else to distract us.

One of the first things anyone told me, when I joined BE, was to remain aware of what might be causing one of these triggers: HALT. Apologies if you've heard this before (I think it's actually an AA thing), but it stands for:

Hunger: eat something - as you know, this can really help! Personally, I quite often confuse an empty belly for the desire to drink.
Anger: so take out your anger, frustration or mood swings here, and write it all down if there's no-one else around to share it with.
Loneliness: 'phone a friend or, again, come here - there's almost always someone on the forum who'll help you to chat your way out of a craving.
Tiredness: a long bath, a DVD, book or an early night, maybe?

I also wanted to suggest turning your obsession with drink into an obsession with not drinking. Consider all the time and energy we've wasted thinking and worrying about when and where the next drink is going to be - do you want your life ruled by those thoughts? Nah! Me neither. Trying to give up drinking is incredibly difficult at first, so turning obsessive thoughts about drink into an obsession with beating those thoughts can be very useful: it still demands a lot of your time, but - as Belle says - at least you'll feel a whole lot better about yourself, the following morning.

As you say, reprogramming our minds is crucial if we're to succeed at this. And to do that, I think we have to try not to forget what brought us here in the first place. Now that's a tricky one, because we all seem incredibly well-programmed to forget quickly how horrible our last hangover was. So, whenever you have a craving but there's absolutely nothing to do and you can't figure out what's triggering the craving, why not try reading through your posts again, from the beginning? You'll get a sense of the progress you've made, but - more importantly, perhaps - your very first posts will remind you how wretched getting drunk made you.

I think that reading old posts is also very important when you get past the initial difficulty of giving up. That's when the euphoria/arrogance/over-confidence of success can kick in: "I've cracked it! Haven't had a drink for --- weeks! Hey, maybe that means I'm cured and I can go and have one now...?"

That may well be true for some people, but for me it hasn't been. Once you get to that stage, I'd urge everyone to re-read their posts. And then make up your mind. Because, ultimately, I think that the best person to "challenge the voices that try to persuade us all to succumb" will be you: the old you who wrote that very first post.

I hope some of that ramble helps!

Best wishes,
Mark

[mai]

Hi Mark
Thank you for the above.. That is a great post, I am only on day 16 and still miss drinking , and I have become obsessed with it, guess it is that’ if you can’t have it’ scenario .. As you say our memory very conveniently allows us to forget the bad times and the hangovers – unfortunately people close to us don’t.. I read other posts on the year and abstinence thread to encourage me that this can be done, and I can make it if I keep trying.. Need some size 10 boots to stomp on that EAF though..
Just mustn’t stop trying
Mai
xxx

[Jarvis]

Thanks Mai!

Yes, it's all a matter of keep on trying. And a good sturdy pair of size 10 boots will certainly help! Congrats on reaching Day 16

Best wishes,
Mark

[spencer13]

Afternoon peeps.....some great posts on here today....it's good to be amongst company who are also in combat with the EAF.....I picture mines as the wringwraiths from Lord of the Rings or the Death Eaters in Harry Potter as for me it sucks the joy and happiness out of my life .....problem is it is a persistent wee beggar and doesn't half have a loud voice....the insanity of drink I guess

I agree keeping busy is key and remembering the things you have done through drinking and the horrible morning after feeling....I've lost count of the days I've lost through hangovers

Anyway...positive positive positive


Lisa
xx

[Lynda21]

I've only just read this thread for the first time, what a great thread it is!

I totally identify with Cullen Skink's story about complacency gradually making you fall back on to the slippery slope. I think that happened to me over the past month.

And Lisa, I share that feeling that my story is boring and mediocre - it's kind of silly to find myself thinking: "I'm even crap at being an alcoholic!!!" - that's the kind of bad place it takes you.

While I readily admit that I have a drinking problem, I think I'm still trying to deny that I'm an incurable alcoholic. It's that hope of being a controlled social drinker that leads you astray. But it worries/depresses me to read of people who have faced up to alcoholism being incurable for them.... sometimes they go for alcohol for 3 months, ( or a year, or two years,) and then crash into a relapse. The last time I went without alcohol for 3 months, I was probably 16 years old, maybe 15. I guess that's true though of a large percentage of the Britain! But if I managed a whole 3 months, I would be dancing in the street and thinking, 'hey, that's enough now, let's crack open the champagne!'

Don't really know what my point is there... but good thread!!

[kevdw]

Hi Lynda21,
Also my first post on this thread, I only joined around a week ago.

I left AA. The main reason being all the 'high and mighty' long term abstainers, who could orate with such skill and wisdom. It just sickened me, and I felt no part of their group.

I joined different support groups at a mental health institute. There, people were allowed to speak out openly, and could converse and pose questions to each other. They were also a lot more messed up, as I was, and down to earth. I felt much more relaxed, and didn't feel like there was "story competition" going on. Support groups also get addictive for many. Anyway, in the end I left as I thought I was cured, and had no time.

Of course, I was just on my path to the next bender. Its a constant cycle for me. Slipping can just suddenly snatch me, without prior warning (or warnings I chose to ignore). Even after reaching rock bottom, the Imp is still waiting to reappear.

I guess we need to somehow get in touch with the inner voices. Not sure how, yet. But will be glad to share when I find it!

KD

[Beverley]

KD
So liked your post. Really brought a lot home for me. I have been on here since last July and went great guns for so long but have been going through a really bad patch.
One thing I know is that I cannot go it alone. I had a long talk with a veteran member who told me she had known so many people who thought they could but they couldn't! So true, so I'm back.

Now I am picking up the pieces again. Good luck on your journey. AA didn't do it for me either.

Bev x

[kevdw]

Hi Beverley,

Happy to receive your response. There's no easy answer, we just need to keep battling. My wife is my biggest hope. But she sometimes has to go to China, and when I'm left alone the pixies come out!

I was just on a US-based recovery site today, and the admin kept deleting my posts for violation of rules (annoying). There was a guy from Panama trying to quit, and had made it very clear he could not get medical attention. I described (not advised) how I had last quit with a slow reduction, when the only choice was that or in-patient treatment (which I really didn't want). Anyway, it seems that all you can say is: "see a doctor, regardless of whether you can".

Think I'll stick with BE for now. But I'm new to forums, so will watch the etiquette in future.

KD x

[Sheila]

KD ... sorry to hear your US forum wasn't a help for you. With BE, none of us are here as 'medical experts', we're here cos we have problems with alcohol, and we're trying to find understanding, help, and support. We just share our experiences, good or bad, and share what's worked for us and what hasn't. We take support when we need it and we give it when we can.
We have members here from all over the world, so I'm sure you'l fit in just nicely
Looking forward to chatting with you around the boards.

[kevdw]

Thanks Sheila,

Yes I have plenty to share, but never want it to be construed as "medical advice".

This guy from Panama had got sick of people telling him to see a doctor, and basically posted that he was going to die if he didn't get any workable advice. Then the admin closed down the thread. Originally, I only went there to see what happened to ProfessorFudger (who blogs there).

I'll be back home to find a new job next week. Hope I still get time to keep posting here. Sometimes, especially with long working hours in Asia, I end up feeling I have no time to give to my recovery. Sad, 'cause it always raises its ugly head some time later.

KD

[farthing]

Mark
That was a very useful post - really helpful in fact. Thank you.
Everyone's different but I find it helpful to tell myself that the most important "me" to please and make happy is the one waking up tomorrow and the one who is around in a few weeks time, rather than the "me" that's around for the next few hours. As soon as I focus on how I'll feel the next day it helps. But then it never used to so it's hopeless advice for some people. I used to not care how I'd feel the next day. And after one glass of anything that "not caring" becomes me again. Which is why, sadly, I can't drink at all. Because I do care and want to care. I don't like turning into someone who stops caring about her self, her future, her tomorrrow. I love waking up day after day as the teetotalling days clock up and feel I'm making progress, in terms of physical and mental wellbeing, as the days go by. I know from experience that just a few drinks one night and then back to teetotalling again the next day would seriously impact on my feelings of wellbeing - it will feel as though the journey is starting again. It's like sliding down the snake in snakes and ladders. You don't maybe go back to square 1, but you certainly go backwards. And going backwards is what drinking does to us. It's a horrible feeling, feeling that you can't move forward in life and progress. And it's this delicious feeling of progress - of walking along a path and going on a productive and enjoyable journey, that's making me get "addicted" to teetotalling. As Mark says, become obsessed about not-drinking. I obsess over my lovely cold becks blues. And my coffee in the morning - idealy I'd work through the psychological issues that lead me to need to obsess. But the priority is to recover. So I'm happy for coffee or teetotalling - or sweets! - addictions to take over. Anything that helps; anything that works.
Lots of love
Pennie xx

[Day]

5 days into my latest effort to stop being a boozed-up twat and I decide to go to the pub with the girls, the drinking girls of course, to celebrate a friend's birthday.

I knew I would drink before my foot was over the door so I can't claim arrogance in a poorly founded belief that I could hack it. The arrogance was still there of course, just it was a f@ck-it kind of arrogance. My Hard earned 5 days of sobriety weren't worth anything compared with the prospect of a session, followed up with me at home drinking into the small hours alone. Nasty. Not much euphoria round here right now, that shiny bubble burst v fast.

[sarahjane162]

Hi,
Went with hubby to dentist last week. while he was in the chair I went for walk,. I bought 1/2 bottle vodka and hid it in my bag. When he was asleep I drank most of it. When I woke up, didn@t feel good but finished it off anyway. Hadn't had drink for months. Hubby noticed. droopy lip+ slurred speech and manner. You've had a drink! No I haven't! Eventually I admitted it.
I destroy any trust he builds up in me. I'm a lying cheating piece of dirt. No willpower. Can't even say why I did it AGAIN

[silvergirl]

ah, sarahjane, hugs to you. you're not a piece of dirt sweetie, you're a human being, who is fallible, and who is quite obviously trying their best with what they've got. one day drinking does not negate all those months you went sober, so rather than beat yourself up for it, can you try to use the experience to spur you on, and to look at what you might do differently next time?

it happened, and you can't change that. i'd say the way to get your husbands trust is to show him that you are trying, and to keep trying whatever happens. (having said that, i don't actually have a husband.) boozing makes me feel very negative about myself too, but the flip side is that when i'm sober i can allow myself to like myself.

welcome to the forum too, by the way.

sgx

[brightonia20]

I felt old behaviours coming back but only realise it now, because i've relapsed.

I will copy and paste two blog entries that i made within two days of making my first entry i had relapsed. relapsed on 6th september.

here is the first entry....

Early days of recovery
Submitted by brightonia20 on September 4th, 2011

Hi all, I thought I would write a blog. Because I know one day I'll look back on it, read it and think ' I've come a long way'. Purely for selfish reasons - obviously!

Two weeks ago I thought I couldn't deal with life without picking up a drink. I couldnt accept that I have this illness. I could say it, which is more than I could do before joining the rooms. I think I'm actually accepting it now. About a month ago now, I went to my first AA meeting. I didn't talk at my first meeting, but the third one I did (only because I didn't have much choice, it was an extremely small, small meeting (and I mean very small!).

But that was the start of my journey, after picking up the phone actually saying out loud ' I am an alcoholic'. The more I learn about this illness, the more I learn to accept it. If anything, I'm just quite relieved to know what's wrong with me. I always thought vodka was the 'devil' and everything went wrong when I drank that. After changing my drinks and still, drinking till black out I realised that was not the problem. Although saying that, I still wasn't ready to admit and aknowledge that their was a problem.

I've had some days where I haven't wanted to be part of this world, the obsession and the craving has been so damn powerful, overwhelming and just painful that I didn't feel like I could do it. I then had two really good days, where some may say I was too well. I soon tripped up and realised, I can never be too well. I never want to be too well, otherwise I'll end up back out there and I cant guarentee that I would make my way back to the rooms.

Today, I've been to two AA meetings. The passion in those rooms is just amazing. People are enjoying their sobriety, they were and are willing to go to any lengths. The 'easier and softer way' is this way. My way didn't work. I have a programme which I need to be living every day. If I'm not living and working the programme its only a matter of time until I'm back out into the chaos.

There's phrases I've heard such as ' give time, time' , ' its slowbriety not sobriety' and also ' I know I have another drink in me, but I don't know that I have another recovery'.
A few weeks ago when I went to my first meeting and somebody said, 'take it one day at a time' I felt like saying ' Don't you realise how hard it is!' Of course they do and did. I have to admit , truth be told that I probably hadn't had enough of the drink, after relapsing after 10 days of sobriety for a few days and since then I have been sober. Whether or not I have another drink left in me, just dooesn't matter. I don't want to re-visit. If anything I'm full of fear that If I drink I just don't know what will happen. I'm experiencing fear of even picking up that drink. I don't need to pick up. It's not the tenth drink, It's the first one that does it. I now understand the allergy that I set off when I put a drink in me. I didn't before. I also understand that there is more to it than just putting down the drink. I have the 'ism'. I can argue with my mind on a daily basis, but aslong as I do the opposite to what it tells me to do I will be okay. Aslong as I surrender every day and accept and admit that I am unmanagable and that I am powerless over it. Then I like to think that I will not drink one day at a time.




I then made this blog entry below today.... whilst it was all so fresh....

Relapse
Submitted by brightonia20 on September 8th, 2011

I relapsed on tuesday night 6th September and had my last drink this morning at around 7am. I thought that it was a resentment that took me back out there. Nah, It was pure arrogance and cockiness. I thought I had felt a change in me, A change that made me feel like I'd mastered the programme within 5 weeks and I was so sure I wouldnt pick up.

Truth is, In the last week old behaviours have been coming back and only can I see that now. Now that the damage has been done, the phonecalls and texts have been made and sent and that I have that raw, fresh, feeling of pure guilt, embarassment, shame and gosh... I don't know. What I do know is that I will not forget how I felt this morning and all day today. I went to a step meeting and the member doing the chair quite rightly said, If you don't do step one properly and 100% you will drink again.

I thought I knew everything because I remembered things people had said in meetings ' its slowbriety not sobrierty'. That made me god, that made me sound smart and like I was working the programme and I knew what I had to do and what I shouldn't do. Quite easy to blame my relapse on a resentment but that would be lying. If I were to be totally honest, I'd say that it was arrogance and cockiness but also, I don't know why I picked up that drink. I'm Jo and I am an alcoholic and I do have the Ism that goes with that. I am powerless over alcohol, If there was any doubt before, the last few days have confirmed that for me. This relapse may have just saved my life. Although obviously I'd rather it hadnt of happened.... It did, and unfortunately I can't change the past, or the future I can only control this present moment in time.

I totally and utterly surrender, I cannot do this alone, I cannot ' fake it to make it '. I thought I knew how cunning, baffling and powerful this illness was, I must not of known as much as I thought I did. I know that when I pick up a drink I'm powerless and I turn into somebody I hate SO much. SO much. I've sent SO many texts today to people, apologising. I said to my sponsor, I'm sick of making the same sodding mistakes and ending up in the same, ugly place... but worse each time. I could never say to the rooms that I enjoyed my relapse, It was lovely... Best few days of my life. That would be total and utter bullshit. It was hell, It was unmanageable, It was embarassing, I'm disgusted with myself. I wasn't putting my recovery first, I thought I was but I wasn't. My recovery must be and is the most important thing to me. I said to people when I had a drink in my hand, dont you try and stop me, I'll fight you. Well, all I can say now is, anyone that trys taking my recovery away from me will have me to deal with. I'm not going to take my own recovery away from myself, and I won't allow anyone else to either. I want sobriety, I don't and can't keep feeling this. If I were to drink again it would go one of two ways, I would drink and drink and drink and drink and lose my job, family, friends, home and end up dying due to alcoholism. OR... I would drink and want to end my life the next morning, because I know one thing for sure, I cannot deal with this feeling of pure disgust, misery, shame and so on again. Like someone once said; I know I've got another drink in me, But I don't know If I have another recovery.

This is painful, this is horrible and my god for all the times I've judged people out of pure arrogance for crying in meetings and for relapsing, I feel utter disgust at myself. I now know through my own experience how painful it is. Only because I found out the hard way.

I wanted to write this experience down because my life depends on remembering how I feel right now in this heartbeat.


Its quite clear to me the difference in the two posts. First one is a bunch of lies and the second one is brutal honesty.

[zoe]

Jo I really think this could be the turning point you know. It is so hard to be honest with ourselves. Drinking ingrains in us a level of self-deception that takes quite some time and practise to root out. Hence we often experience a series of these "mental capitulations" as we progress through the early stages of recovery. Thing is Jo I don't think it's that we're not being honest enough necessarily as that seems so harsh when in fact we are usually just doing our best and struggling against years of behaving a certain way ... I just think it takes time to learn true honesty. It takes such courage to be honest ... to face these things head on and realise that we're not strong enough to do this without help. That's OK though ... who on this earth doesn't need help with certain aspects of life?

I read a deep sorrow in your post Jo and I think it's one many of us can relate to. So many tries to get this sorted and it can feel that we were just "playing" at it all this time. How else to eplain so many lapses and day ones? It's all to easy to slip into self recrimination for not having done better sooner. I spent a long time stuck in the mire of these emotions and it stalled my recovery so much because I was so busy focussing on this shame, guilt, blame ... all very difficult emotions that largely served to make me want to drink them all away.

Try if you can to bypass these feelings and focus instead on what you can do today to make progress. Today is what really matters I reckon. Warmest hugs to you and thanks for posting Jo. I struggle with honesty myself so I got a lot out of reading such powerful honesty in your post. xx Jos

[farthing]

Jo I'm dashing off for supper but wanted to send you lots of hugs. The last morning after I had drinks I felt like you have described all day. Really heartbroken really, as I'd just gone a long (for me long) stint and just felt so bluddy, bluddy sad, fed up, disgusted and in despair about it. But I look back now and feel so proud that that's the way I felt, because that disgust shows that I had high standards for my self. Worse if there's no self-criticism. When we do anything that's bad for us or bad for someone else then it's our conscience that really keeps us straight - we do need a bit of that. I wouldn't be sober now if I knew how awful I'd feel - not just physically but really really sad and distressed - if I gave in and drank. So your self-flagellation will serve a good purpose but it feels bluddy shit now, I know sweetheart. I have been there hundreds of times - hundreds. I have hated myself and my actions so much over the years.
I hope you are feeling better already and hope things get back on track for you straight away - I'm sure they will. You show such passion and determination.
Lots of love
Pennie xx

[brightonia20]

You know what, after speaking to my AA sponsor I'm glad it happened. Everything happens for a reason, and I obviously needed a reminder of why I don't want to and can't drink. I don't feel like I want to die when I'm sober, only the thought of having that drink and the morning after. I don't want to die, so I will not put myself in the situation where I then feel like suicide is my only option. It doesn't have to be. I need to get spiritually, physically and mentally well and I need to remember that this does not happen in a week or two, its a programme of progression and a learning process, we learn from feeling and experiences. This was obviously meant to happen to me.

Thanks for all your kind words, There's probably a tiny bit of shame and guilt left about what happened, but I know that the longer I sit with that the closer I am to another drink.

It's now about keeping it simple, sticking with the spiritual well winners... and staying away from those who will take me back out there to another drink.

All, enjoy your weekend and learn from your experiences like i am.

xxx

[notorious]

You know what, after speaking to my AA sponsor I'm glad it happened. Everything happens for a reason, and I obviously needed a reminder of why I don't want to and can't drink. I don't feel like I want to die when I'm sober, only the thought of having that drink and the morning after. I don't want to die, so I will not put myself in the situation where I then feel like suicide is my only option. It doesn't have to be. I need to get spiritually, physically and mentally well and I need to remember that this does not happen in a week or two, its a programme of progression and a learning process, we learn from feeling and experiences. This was obviously meant to happen to me.

Thanks for all your kind words, There's probably a tiny bit of shame and guilt left about what happened, but I know that the longer I sit with that the closer I am to another drink.

It's now about keeping it simple, sticking with the spiritual well winners... and staying away from those who will take me back out there to another drink.

All, enjoy your weekend and learn from your experiences like i am.

xxx

Hi Brightonia20.

You're definately right. There's absolutely no value whatsoever in beating yourself up. It's happened. Done. It's what you do with it that counts. You seem to have got things pretty much in perspective, which isn't at all easy after a blip, so you should be pleased with yourself for that alone.

Anyway, I posted this over on the RtA thread after my own 'fall' following my a year of abstinence and consquent absence from the board...

it seems appropropriate here, so I hope you don't mind my re-posting.

Hi All

It's been a while since I last posted. I dunno, turn my back for 5 minutes (or 4 months) and the Abstinence threads all new and improved!!

It's been a tricky few months, long story short my move turned out to be an unmitigated diaster (as I think I posted at the time) due to a major blip, well, more of a train wreck really. It was quite a scary timeto be honest. After that first drink (and a few subsequent self pitying drunken posts and PMs on BE) after a year off I couldn't quite comprehend what I had done.

The guilt and self loathing was far, far worse than the physical withdrawal - so of course I simply retreated back into a series of major vodka benders, going through that impossible cycle again, fear, doubt, lack of self worth, and the rather indulgant and ultimately pointless self pity, leading back to hospital once again. The sense of failure was overwhelming at times (still is if I'm honest, but I'm better equipped to deal with it now I think). No lasting physical damage other than more dramatic weight loss, which I'm fixing, and having to be seen regularly (every 2 months initially) at the outpatients clinic I was visiting previously to keep tabs on the liver. I'm not complaining - I keep on being unbelieveably lucky. But I just can't push that luck anymore - I must have used all my get of jail free cards now, surely.

I've come to realise that I clearly wasn't ready to take on the massive upheaval that I undertook, completely alone. It's almost laugable - most of the period April-June is just an impossible, hazy, sickening blur. I still can't quite believe the series of events that unfolded, and the alarmingly rapid return to the self destruct.
I had everything I had been working towards for the last year, great job, nice place, financial security, physically in the best shape of my life - BUT - I hadn't addressed the underlying issues properly. That's the main crux of it for me.

Thankfully I'm tackling those issues now, with structured counselling (I was on the waiting list for the whole year I thought I had 'mended' myself) and am once again back at home, back in the saddle and on the road once more.

A harsh, harsh lesson, but one I'm glad I learnt in a perverse sort of way. I can't afford to think I've won. Not yet - I realise now that in reality, I'd really just got started when it all unravelled in such a familiarly spectacular fashion.

Anyway - looking forward to getting back into things on BE. I've got a bit of catching up to do!

Cheers all, take care

Seán